Car shopping and the CVT

[Bounce]

My only Subaru regret was getting the 2013 Impreza Sport LTD with CVT. Of all the loaners and models we've owned, this is the only to be so dogtastic.

[Vulcanbill]

Oil change last night.  As usual, took about 7 minutes most of which was oil draining.  210,075 miles.  Transmission still making noise.  Transmission still making the car go. 

[ChrisFZ1]

I have an '07 Toyota Corolla with 266K, standard transmission.  Transmission make no noise. Original transmission and clutch. Car still go strong.

[zer0netgain]

Toyota’s CVTs are solid.  Can’t say that about anyone else.  Since the Prius was going to have CVT and Prius was a flagship line, Toyota couldn’t afford a bum transmission.  If they change a design, they improve on it and don’t put out something questionable.

[melville]

It begins, as was inevitable...

I was driving to work Monday or Tuesday and the car started "shifting" when it shouldn't.  Nothing stupid, just didn't need that downshift but it was there anyway.  I moved to the right lane and waited.  Dashboard goes Christmas tree on me.  Hill hold assist, ABS, TCS, check engine, AT Trans Temp and cruise control lights all come on with the last 2 flashing.  OK.  Nothing is red and I can live without all the nanny crap anyway.  Found someone w/ an ODBII reader at work and got a "TCC Pressure Control Solenoid circuit low" code.  Did a little research.  It's not pretty.  Cleared the codes but then it threw them again on the way home.  Took the car in yesterday and I called today to find out its a 1500 dollar job.  Ouch.  The car has nearly 182K miles and I've literally put 500 dollars into repairs in all that time.  So, amortized over the life of the car, it's not terrible.  Just sucks that it's tax time and we just dropped a bunch of money on a fence and skid steer rental.  Whatever.  It's not 22K in taxes owed.  I'm not a huge fan of paying dealer prices but they've always been awesome and we got a brand new Forester w/ 72 miles as a loaner, no questions. 

Funny part.  None of our vehicles have any of this intelligent crap so when Kim started driving this Forester with all the new stuff activated, she freaked out.  The car was trying to steer for her, then it hit the brakes when she didn't want it to and then it died at the stoplight.  She was certain it was demon possessed and wanted to kill it.  Listening to her tell the story, I nearly peed.  She's clever tho.  She figured out how to turn some of it off and I'm sure she'll turn the rest of before embarking on her day today.  Still funny.

A lot of current cars die at stop lights these days, then restart the moment you hit the gas to go.

And when I hear that as a pedestrian, my first thought is "Oh, you're learning stick!  Good for you, you'll get it eventually!"

[Vulcanbill]

It begins, as was inevitable...

I was driving to work Monday or Tuesday and the car started "shifting" when it shouldn't.  Nothing stupid, just didn't need that downshift but it was there anyway.  I moved to the right lane and waited.  Dashboard goes Christmas tree on me.  Hill hold assist, ABS, TCS, check engine, AT Trans Temp and cruise control lights all come on with the last 2 flashing.  OK.  Nothing is red and I can live without all the nanny crap anyway.  Found someone w/ an ODBII reader at work and got a "TCC Pressure Control Solenoid circuit low" code.  Did a little research.  It's not pretty.  Cleared the codes but then it threw them again on the way home.  Took the car in yesterday and I called today to find out its a 1500 dollar job.  Ouch.  The car has nearly 182K miles and I've literally put 500 dollars into repairs in all that time.  So, amortized over the life of the car, it's not terrible.  Just sucks that it's tax time and we just dropped a bunch of money on a fence and skid steer rental.  Whatever.  It's not 22K in taxes owed.  I'm not a huge fan of paying dealer prices but they've always been awesome and we got a brand new Forester w/ 72 miles as a loaner, no questions. 

Funny part.  None of our vehicles have any of this intelligent crap so when Kim started driving this Forester with all the new stuff activated, she freaked out.  The car was trying to steer for her, then it hit the brakes when she didn't want it to and then it died at the stoplight.  She was certain it was demon possessed and wanted to kill it.  Listening to her tell the story, I nearly peed.  She's clever tho.  She figured out how to turn some of it off and I'm sure she'll turn the rest of before embarking on her day today.  Still funny.

A lot of current cars die at stop lights these days, then restart the moment you hit the gas to go.

And when I hear that as a pedestrian, my first thought is "Oh, you're learning stick!  Good for you, you'll get it eventually!"

Gotta wonder if the trade off in gas mileage is worth what I would bet is reduced starter / battery life.  Time will tell I suppose.  Change is bad, mkay?

[Cablebandit]

Ours tells us how much fuel has been saved.  I'm not worried about the starter, I'm more concerned with the engine start considering the oils used these days are so thin.  Also if you need to scoot out of the way in a hurry starting the engine takes critical time.


I turn the stupid feature off ever time I get in the car.

[Vulcanbill]

Ours tells us how much fuel has been saved.  I'm not worried about the starter, I'm more concerned with the engine start considering the oils used these days are so thin.  Also if you need to scoot out of the way in a hurry starting the engine takes critical time.


I turn the stupid feature off ever time I get in the car.

You could probably make a mint if you could create a doohicky that turns it off permanently.

[Cablebandit]

It won't activate if you ease into a stop slow enough.

My work neighbor has a Mercedes and she said her's learned how she drives and after turning it off a million time it no longer activates.  I told her it a Mercedes....it probably just broke.   

[stevent]

I had a Ford Edge for a loaner when our Highlander was in the shop. It had that lane assist-stoppy startty nonsense too. Easy enough to turn it off but a pain in the butt all the same. I think it had the automatic braking too but I didn't have the nerve to try it just in case.

I suppose it has it's use but I'd get tired of it pretty quickly once the novelty wore off.

[coho]

I had a Ford Edge for a loaner when our Highlander was in the shop. It had that lane assist-stoppy startty nonsense too. Easy enough to turn it off but a pain in the butt all the same. I think it had the automatic braking too but I didn't have the nerve to try it just in case.

I suppose it has it's use but I'd get tired of it pretty quickly once the novelty wore off.

Or you'd get used to it and no longer notice.

[Bounce]

I had a Ford Edge for a loaner when our Highlander was in the shop. It had that lane assist-stoppy startty nonsense too. Easy enough to turn it off but a pain in the butt all the same. I think it had the automatic braking too but I didn't have the nerve to try it just in case.

I suppose it has it's use but I'd get tired of it pretty quickly once the novelty wore off.

Or you'd get used to it and no longer notice.

I had a loaner Subaru once while ours was being serviced. The auto-distancing thing defaulted to off. I could easily see someone turn it on and get used to it long enough then forget to turn it on that one time and WHAM!

Had the stop/start on a recent Toyota loaner. Ack! I hated that.

[Black Hills]

them damn automatic transmissions. if you can't drive a manual you shouldn't be on the road......... err...uh,  nevermind...

[Skee]

them damn automatic transmissions. if you can't drive a manual you shouldn't be on the road......... err...uh,  nevermind...

I’m a good bit more reactionary; if you can’t ride, you probably can’t drive well either. 

Given the level of ability on this forum, I’m not surprised at the level of resistance to electronic driver aids.  They really work well.  Many of them were standard features on rentals in EU long before they started showing up on new cars in the States. 

I remember the first time I encountered lane departure assist.  I felt a little resistance changing lanes on the autostrada and pulled off at the next exit to check the steering and the tires.  We had to change the screen language to English and read the instructions.  But it really makes highwayman driving a breeze, but they are annoying in town.  I won’t buy a new car without all these features.

I doubt they’ll ever get widespread adoption among Americans.  No idiot machine is going to annoy me when I’m drifting out of my lane. 

One feature I haven’t seen on America cars - one that I’d like to have on my motorcycle - is called a limitator in some languages. You can set one or 2 speed limits on your dash.  When you exceed the first one,you hear a pleasant chime.  Throttle input stops when you reach the second.   Really nice for maintaining your sanity in towns where there are likely to be speed traps.  Turn it off on the highway

[naustin]

I have an '18 WRX with 3 pedals for when i need a cage.   It it not an STI  - just the base 6-speed.  The only option on the window sticker is the Short-Throw shifter.   No electronic B/S, except anti-lock brakes and cruise control.   I love it.   Everything is mechanical and analog - and it is wonderful.

[stevent]

them damn automatic transmissions. if you can't drive a manual you shouldn't be on the road......... err...uh,  nevermind...

How about that electronic fuel injection and ignition too? The mechanical fuel injection and ignition on my '71 Squareback worked just fine damn it. $20. for a set of Injector points and a couple of bucks for a cap, rotor, ignition points and condenser and 1/2 an hour later you're fahren fahren fahren on das Autobahn.

No gad dam $140.p/h shop labor either...

  

[Cablebandit]

Given the [self percieved] level of ability on this forum,

[Black Hills]

them damn automatic transmissions. if you can't drive a manual you shouldn't be on the road......... err...uh,  nevermind...

How about that electronic fuel injection and ignition too? The mechanical fuel injection and ignition on my '71 Squareback worked just fine damn it. $20. for a set of Injector points and a couple of bucks for a cap, rotor, ignition points and condenser and 1/2 an hour later you're fahren fahren fahren on das Autobahn.

No gad dam $140.p/h shop labor either...

 

and don't get me started on them damn radial tires! they don't work like bias ply in the snow.

[stevent]

them damn automatic transmissions. if you can't drive a manual you shouldn't be on the road......... err...uh,  nevermind...

How about that electronic fuel injection and ignition too? The mechanical fuel injection and ignition on my '71 Squareback worked just fine damn it. $20. for a set of Injector points and a couple of bucks for a cap, rotor, ignition points and condenser and 1/2 an hour later you're fahren fahren fahren on das Autobahn.

No gad dam $140.p/h shop labor either...

 

and don't get me started on them damn radial tires! they don't work like bias ply in the snow.

How the hell are you supposed to know how much air's in 'em? sons o' bitches look half flat all the time!

 

[Skee]

Given the [self percieved] level of ability on this forum,

Most of us can ride better than that

[Bounce]

I have an '18 WRX with 3 pedals for when i need a cage.   It it not an STI  - just the base 6-speed.  The only option on the window sticker is the Short-Throw shifter.   No electronic B/S, except anti-lock brakes and cruise control.   I love it.   Everything is mechanical and analog - and it is wonderful.

My '03 Bugeye was a 5 speed. The '08 STi was a 6. Had to put in a Kartboys short-throw shifter in the WRX but the STi was copacetic. STi has traction control and you could see it tuck an under-steer back to normal with the push of the button (from off to on). Since '08, Subie has let the STi languish while heaping improvements into the WRX that have closed the gap so much that the STi can't be justified for the price difference anymore.

[Vulcanbill]

Aaaaaand...  the party's over.  Transmission is done.  Subaru just called w/ a $7-8K quote to replace it.  Car is worth about half that...maybe.  Not the end of the world for a transmission to give up the ghost at over 200k miles.  Many a non CVT transmission has died with fewer miles.  Of course that's the dealership cost so now the shopping starts for a local shop w/ half the labor rate to source one from a salvage yard or similar.  We shall see.  Good times.  Kinda new the jig would be up at some point with two vehicles w/ over 200k.  Hopefully the truck will hang strong long enough to get the car fixed.  Ideally it'll go till we get the quad and camper paid off then it's time for the big boy truck.    Glad Kim works from home. 

[sleazy rider]

I would expect an OTD cost with a recycled trans to easily come in under $2k.  When the manual trans in the Focus spat its synchros, I paid just over $600 for a 60k mile used one installed.

[Baxter]

Good luck.  A bro-in-law replaced a transmission with a used refurbished unit and saved a substantial amount of money compared to the dealer.  It's been three months, and the refurbished unit hasn't shown any problems.

Reminds me of when the transmission in an Audi I once made the mistake of owning started to act up.  I Googled "transmission problems" without parental controls.  A lot of, how shall I say it, sites that were unrelated to automobile transmissions were in the search results. I was very glad that this wasn't on my work computer.   

[Vulcanbill]

I would expect an OTD cost with a recycled trans to easily come in under $2k.  When the manual trans in the Focus spat its synchros, I paid just over $600 for a 60k mile used one installed.

That would be lovely.  I suspect, however, that the CVT will bring a premium for reason I can not yet fathom.  I got a couple names from my nephew in the business so I'll be calling around tomorrow.  Will also check local trans places to see if the to repairs on CVTs at all.

[Vulcanbill]

Aaaaand we're back. A little over $1700 for a used trans with 62 k miles on it. Just picked it up and all seems to be well.  Just got some work done on the truck as well so starting the new year off right.  In a poorhouse kind of way.