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Offline giaka

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Shotguns
« on: December 11, 2013, 01:28:10 PM »
How did we miss this one?  8)

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Offline Cookie

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #1 on: December 11, 2013, 01:29:29 PM »
To lazy to take a new pic and upload it.

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Offline bomber

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #2 on: December 11, 2013, 01:51:49 PM »
M1 Carbine up above?
We had two bags of grass, 75 pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a saltshaker half-full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers... Also, a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether, and two dozen amyls. Not that we needed all that for the trip, but once you get locked into a serious drug collection, the tendency is to push it as far as you can.

Offline Cookie

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #3 on: December 11, 2013, 01:54:29 PM »
M1 Carbine up above?

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Offline Jim

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #4 on: December 11, 2013, 02:26:37 PM »
I've been thinking of a first shotgun. What are some of the classics or "must haves" to be considered?

In addition to the first question, what if narrowed to pump action (those interest me the most)?

I have yet to hunt so it'd be for range work.
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Offline bomber

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #5 on: December 11, 2013, 02:35:45 PM »
We had two bags of grass, 75 pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a saltshaker half-full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers... Also, a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether, and two dozen amyls. Not that we needed all that for the trip, but once you get locked into a serious drug collection, the tendency is to push it as far as you can.

Offline khuffy

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #6 on: December 11, 2013, 02:46:26 PM »
I've been thinking of a first shotgun. What are some of the classics or "must haves" to be considered?

In addition to the first question, what if narrowed to pump action (those interest me the most)?

I have yet to hunt so it'd be for range work.

Personally I'm looking for an older Remington 870 pump, either a wingmaster or a magnum, right now.  The quality of manufacturing was better on the old ones I have been told. 

I fired a bunch of rounds through my buddy's Mossberg 500 and that seemed like a decent firearm as well.

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #7 on: December 11, 2013, 02:48:57 PM »
Browning BPS w/28" barrel and their adjustable choke system. shooting 6 shot early in the season an 4 as the season drags on (longer shots). Great for pheasants and keeping the barn free of pigeons, as well as an occasional trip tot he sporting clays or trap range. I think it will work fine for personal defense if it comes to that as well.  ;)
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Offline CLAY

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #8 on: December 11, 2013, 03:26:51 PM »
I've been thinking of a first shotgun. What are some of the classics or "must haves" to be considered?

In addition to the first question, what if narrowed to pump action (those interest me the most)?

I have yet to hunt so it'd be for range work.

I've owned, do own, and have shot many different makes.  Without a doubt I would choose the Remington 870 as the one do-all shotgun.  I wouldn't say I'm an expert in many areas, but this is probably as close as I come.  Slap their good scoped, rifled barrel on the end and you have an honest 150-200 yard gun (if you do some testing).  Any brand sabot slug you're easy good to 100.  The 870 Supermag is my current do-all.  I have the scoped super-slug barrel (not sure they make it any more)- it's 2" longer and a little stiffer, and I would not hesitate to take a 200 yard shot if I wanted to.  As it is I have taken many deer out to 165 yards (the long shot where I hunt).  It's a simple, proven design, and opposed to a Mossberg or Winchester it's tight.  I also have a Mossberg 500 and a Mossberg 835 with the rifled, scoped barrel as well and the Rem will out shoot moth of them.

The one area where the Mossberg 835 shines is in long-range shot work.  The 835 is a 12 gauge but has a 10 gauge barrel- this creates tighter groupings out further than a 12 gauge barrel.  If I am turkey hunting or late season goose, I grab the 835.  I think my turkey long shot was 65 yards with the 835 and a red-dot scope.

Mossberg 500's are cheap and reliable, but the fit and functionality is better on the Rem 870, IMO.  I own both- my Mossberg 500 now has the tube extension on it.  I own a few more as well, but these are the go-to shotguns for me. 

HTH.   :thumbsup:
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Offline Mr. Whippy

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #9 on: December 11, 2013, 03:33:39 PM »
Love my 870.  Stone reliable.  I recently picked up a Benelli Montefeltro.  It is a thing of beauty, but I doubt I'm going to want to slog it through the "wetlands" on our farm.   

It is going to get some work in the spring/summer when it's warm enough to shot trap  :bigsmile:

Offline Cookie

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #10 on: December 11, 2013, 03:37:05 PM »
That 12 gauge above is a very inexpensive, under $200.00 Norinco copy of the 870. Heavy as a battleship but solid reliable.
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Offline giaka

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #11 on: December 11, 2013, 03:40:41 PM »
That 12 gauge above is a very inexpensive, under $200.00 Norinco copy of the 870. Heavy as a battleship but solid reliable.

Do you know if they make a Jr model in 12 or 20 gauge?
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Offline Cookie

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #12 on: December 11, 2013, 03:42:49 PM »
This is the line up.
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Offline Mr. Whippy

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #13 on: December 11, 2013, 04:15:04 PM »
I've been thinking of a first shotgun. What are some of the classics or "must haves" to be considered?

In addition to the first question, what if narrowed to pump action (those interest me the most)?

I have yet to hunt so it'd be for range work.

Personally I'm looking for an older Remington 870 pump, either a wingmaster or a magnum, right now.  The quality of manufacturing was better on the old ones I have been told. 

I fired a bunch of rounds through my buddy's Mossberg 500 and that seemed like a decent firearm as well.

The old Wingmasters are beautiful.  Too beautiful for the way I handle guns.  I'd feel badly every time it sat out in the rain with me.

Offline CLAY

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #14 on: December 11, 2013, 05:43:53 PM »
The old Wingmasters are beautiful.  Too beautiful for the way I handle guns.  I'd feel badly every time it sat out in the rain with me.

My first pump gun was an 870 20 ga Wingmaster.  I still have it and use it to shoot bunnies every winter.  I shot my first 20 or so deer with that gun- I got it from my grandpa.  That one will be a passer-downer.   :thumbsup:
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Offline Jim

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #15 on: December 11, 2013, 06:30:10 PM »
Looking at the Remington 870 line, two models mentioned are here:

Model 870™ Wingmaster, MSRP $818
http://www.remington.com/en/products/firearms/shotguns/model-870/model-870-wingmaster.aspx

Model 870™ Express® Super Magnum Combo, MSRP $620
http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/shotguns/model-870/model-870-express-super-mag-combo.aspx?panel=1#data

Q's:
1) How common are interchangeable barrels for shotguns? This is new to me seeing it an option (and you folks talking about it).

2) I don't understand why the super magnum combo, with two barrels, has a lower MSRP when "the rest of the gun" seems quite similar to the Wingmaster. Does the wingmaster simply command a higher msrp due to higher market value (and not increased materials & production costs that I assume the combo has)?
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Offline giaka

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #16 on: December 11, 2013, 07:12:16 PM »
This is the line up.



I see they make a youth 20 gauge. Off to the gunstore I go.

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Offline CLAY

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #17 on: December 11, 2013, 08:16:53 PM »
Looking at the Remington 870 line, two models mentioned are here:

Model 870™ Wingmaster, MSRP $818
http://www.remington.com/en/products/firearms/shotguns/model-870/model-870-wingmaster.aspx

Model 870™ Express® Super Magnum Combo, MSRP $620
http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/shotguns/model-870/model-870-express-super-mag-combo.aspx?panel=1#data

Q's:
1) How common are interchangeable barrels for shotguns? This is new to me seeing it an option (and you folks talking about it).

2) I don't understand why the super magnum combo, with two barrels, has a lower MSRP when "the rest of the gun" seems quite similar to the Wingmaster. Does the wingmaster simply command a higher msrp due to higher market value (and not increased materials & production costs that I assume the combo has)?


The Wingmaster is the premier grade gun- great fit and finish, blued, usually highly polished and finished wood stock.  Gorgeous.

The Express is the "hunter" (lower cost as well) version- usually parkerized or camoed, plain wood or synthetic stock.  My 870 SuperMag (the SuperMags will take 3 1/2 inch shells) is camo/synthetic.  It gets abused in the various blinds and in the various weather conditions.  I'd be a bit more careful about taking a Wingmaster out in places like that, although my 20 ga Wingmaster did it for about 8-10 years.  It's not perfect anymore, but it looks good yet.

The barrels are like Legos- among the 12 ga 870's, they all interchange.  However when you throw a 3" barrel on a supermag, 3 1/2 inch shells won't fit, and a 3 1/2 supermag barrel on a regular 870 won't work either- you can't feed a 3 1/2 shell into a regular 870 receiver.  However you can throw a 3" barrel on a supermag and feed 2 3/4 and 3" shells through it all day.  My rifled barrel is 3"- no problems, I feed it 2 3/4 Remington Core-Lock sabots anyway (they shoot more accurately than the 3").

I must have one of these:
http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/shotguns/model-870/model-870-express-super-mag-turkey-camo.aspx
because mine is full camo.
Second I bought the fully rifled cantilevered barrel.  They make a "Superslug" model- that's the barrel I have.  It's 25 1/2" long instead of the usual 23".  I didn't buy the combo- I bought the barrel separately because I wanted to get the longer one.  Of course that was 15 or so years ago.  I'm not sure they still offer the superslug barrel separately.


If I were going to get an autoloader, I'd get the Benelli Super Black Eagle 2.  Again I have lots of time behind various models- Browning BPS, Gold, Winchesters and the Rems, and the Benelli took the most abuse and kept going.  However I must preface that by saying I haven't seriously looked at an autoloader for probably 10 years, and I know there have been some advancements in design in the various models.  My experience with the autoloaders was in duck and goose hunting, and a late-season goose gun in Michigan takes some serious abuse.

HTH!
« Last Edit: December 11, 2013, 08:27:10 PM by CLAY »
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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #18 on: December 11, 2013, 08:47:32 PM »
I have a Benelli Super Nova 12ga pump.  It's camo.  It was a bit of a panic purchase.  Shoots really well.  Almost disturbing what you can do w/ slugs and at what distances with this gun.  Kim has the M'berg 500 pistol grip.  Stupid fun and back up for home defense.  It'll eat anything.  And as much as I hate it when people jump on the bandwagon in the motorcycle world with the whole "buy what I have" mentality, I'm gonna do it here. 

Since I'm not yet a hunter and don't appreciate the art of the shotgun, I genuinely don't understand why, other than the slightly prohibitive cost, everyone doesn't have one of these:

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Most fun to shoot and delivers an amazing death potential in a very short period of time.  LOVE!
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Offline Jim

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #19 on: December 11, 2013, 09:22:21 PM »
Thanks folks, I appreciate the good info. Time will tell (and the online MSRP prices don't seem crazy to me)...
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Offline Royal Tiger

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #20 on: December 12, 2013, 10:12:45 AM »
If I would just stop buying stuff for all these motorcycles, I could finally start adding to my firearm collection!  :D

I really want a synthetic Remington 870 Police Magnum.  Cabela's (yes, I dread the "experts" there) had it I think for under $400 or $500.
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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #21 on: December 12, 2013, 10:49:03 AM »


Since I'm not yet a hunter and don't appreciate the art of the shotgun, I genuinely don't understand why, other than the slightly prohibitive cost, everyone doesn't have one of these:


because you are not a hunter ;). a good shotgun works well for what is was designed for, upland bird or waterfowl hunting. these black guns are for an entirely different purpose and best suited for screwing off at the range, impressing people and perhaps the one in a million chance you would use it for actual personal defense. Of course a nice field model will probably do just as good of a job.
the above are merely the ramblings of a hamfisted fuckwit who has broken too many helmets.

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #22 on: December 12, 2013, 04:10:53 PM »
what ya all think about the Benelli Nova tactical?  some day i would love to own a shotgun, but it will probably only get used for target (once in a while) and home protection (hopefully never have to use it).  No hunting involved except with future rifle purchases.
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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #23 on: December 12, 2013, 05:26:38 PM »
hmm

mine were old.
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Offline Mr. Whippy

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #24 on: December 12, 2013, 06:28:20 PM »
hmm

mine were old.
Papa,

What did you have?  I presume mostly break action?

Offline CLAY

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #25 on: December 12, 2013, 08:50:11 PM »
All my experience is with hunting guns or modified hunting guns.  I do know that when I took my Mossberg 500 (with extended tube) out skeet shooting a couple months ago it swings like a bear when it's full.   :lol:
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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #26 on: December 12, 2013, 08:55:32 PM »


Since I'm not yet a hunter and don't appreciate the art of the shotgun, I genuinely don't understand why, other than the slightly prohibitive cost, everyone doesn't have one of these:


because you are not a hunter ;). a good shotgun works well for what is was designed for, upland bird or waterfowl hunting. these black guns are for an entirely different purpose and best suited for screwing off at the range, impressing people and perhaps the one in a million chance you would use it for actual personal defense. Of course a nice field model will probably do just as good of a job.

So you're saying you're impressed then.  Cool. 
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Offline Smilodon_Con

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #27 on: December 14, 2013, 05:04:15 PM »
what ya all think about the Benelli Nova tactical?  some day i would love to own a shotgun, but it will probably only get used for target (once in a while) and home protection (hopefully never have to use it).  No hunting involved except with future rifle purchases.

Check out the Linberta 12ga. semi auto. Pistol grip gas operated Turkish made clone of a Benelli M3, I'm fairly impressed with it. Very nicely made and utterly reliable with any shotshell you can feed it.

My opinion: screw that "accurately placing shots with low recoil" mantra that the AR enthusiasts chant.

Pop the barrel mounted 800 lumen floodlight on and clear the room with 00 buckshot or a good 3" turkey load bleary eyed at 3:00 am.

I'm sure any additional rats will run for the door when they hear the cannon fire.

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« Last Edit: December 14, 2013, 05:14:17 PM by Smilodon_Con »

Offline Mr. Whippy

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #28 on: December 14, 2013, 05:26:41 PM »
The beauty of a pump action is that everyone knows what that sound means.  Pump in a shell, and it's likely you'll never have to fire it.

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #29 on: December 14, 2013, 05:43:22 PM »
The beauty of a pump action is that everyone knows what that sound means.  Pump in a shell, and it's likely you'll never have to fire it.

Absolutely.  I've used that to great effect at work numerous times.
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Offline Smilodon_Con

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #30 on: December 14, 2013, 05:48:15 PM »
Tend to agree with that but the mag tube release and bolt crank of a semi-auto is a reassuring sound as well.

I've had pumps and semi's, I prefer the semi. As long as they are reliable. Only range testing can prove that. If you have an umreliable semi you may as well habe an H&R single shot. I had an SKB auto once that wouldnt feed worth a damn. Many birds flew away unscathed.

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« Last Edit: December 14, 2013, 07:16:01 PM by Smilodon_Con »

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #31 on: December 14, 2013, 07:10:29 PM »
Hey Cookie, did you ever get that coach gun you were pining for?
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Offline CLAY

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #32 on: December 14, 2013, 08:26:17 PM »
The only problem I have with a semi is that in a pinch, when you are in the dirt, or floor, or whatever- the pump will cycle as long as you make it so.  The semi can hang up.

I think they both have their places, but there's a reason why police and the armed forces tend to stick to pumps.
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Offline Cookie

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Re: Shotguns
« Reply #33 on: December 15, 2013, 07:10:58 AM »
Hey Cookie, did you ever get that coach gun you were pining for?I

Maybe tax time.
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