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Author Topic: R.I.P. Madiba  (Read 9433 times)

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Online Flyer

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R.I.P. Madiba
« on: December 05, 2013, 03:51:38 PM »
Nelson Mandela has passed, and the world becomes a lesser place today.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2013, 04:31:27 PM by Flyer »
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Offline hambonee

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Re: R.I.P. Mandiba
« Reply #1 on: December 05, 2013, 04:02:37 PM »
 :'(

RIP..


Offline Justin

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Re: R.I.P. Mandiba
« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2013, 04:06:05 PM »
RIP Mr. Mandela
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Re: R.I.P. Mandiba
« Reply #3 on: December 05, 2013, 04:16:53 PM »
Sucks to hear.
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Offline bomber

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Re: R.I.P. Mandiba
« Reply #4 on: December 05, 2013, 04:17:10 PM »
A giant, to be sure.
We had two bags of grass, 75 pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a saltshaker half-full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers... Also, a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether, and two dozen amyls. Not that we needed all that for the trip, but once you get locked into a serious drug collection, the tendency is to push it as far as you can.

Offline Mr. Whippy

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Re: R.I.P. Mandiba
« Reply #5 on: December 05, 2013, 04:21:50 PM »
A world leader who will be considered in the same league as Gandhi. 

Tremendous loss.

Offline CLAY

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Re: R.I.P. Mandiba
« Reply #6 on: December 05, 2013, 04:22:37 PM »
A world leader who will be considered in the same league as Gandhi. 

Tremendous loss.

Yes- a sad day indeed. 
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Re: R.I.P. Mandiba
« Reply #7 on: December 05, 2013, 04:26:24 PM »
A great man, R.I.P.

“I am fundamentally an optimist. Whether that comes from nature or nurture, I cannot say. Part of being optimistic is keeping one's head pointed toward the sun, one's feet moving forward. There were many dark moments when my faith in humanity was sorely tested, but I would not and could not give myself up to despair. That way lays defeat and death.”
― Nelson Mandela

“I have walked that long road to freedom. I have tried not to falter; I have made missteps along the way. But I have discovered the secret that after climbing a great hill, one only finds that there are many more hills to climb. I have taken a moment here to rest, to steal a view of the glorious vista that surrounds me, to look back on the distance I have come. But I can only rest for a moment, for with freedom come responsibilities, and I dare not linger, for my long walk is not ended.”
― Nelson Mandela
the above are merely the ramblings of a hamfisted fuckwit who has broken too many helmets.

Online miles

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #8 on: December 05, 2013, 05:17:52 PM »
RIP.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2013, 05:37:12 PM by miles »
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Offline DNA

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #9 on: December 05, 2013, 05:42:16 PM »
Very sad day.
You may find yourself living in a shotgun shack  -You may find yourself in another part of the world
You may find yourself behind the wheel of a large automobile- You may find yourself in a beautiful house with a beautiful wife-
You may ask yourself, well, how did I get here?

Offline PatM

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #10 on: December 05, 2013, 06:37:28 PM »
yes sad but then he's had a long life.

Rest in peace old man, we'll try to make this earth a peaceful place.
Ride safe!

Offline Meemuh

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #11 on: December 06, 2013, 04:02:57 PM »
Yup, he was an important person in history.  Certainly a newsworthy event.


Why fricking ESPN radio felt the need to beat the subject to death, I'll never know.

Offline CLAY

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #12 on: December 06, 2013, 04:16:12 PM »
Anybody done any research into his past with the ANC?  It seems a little disturbing.  I've see a couple posts about him in places and have been doing a little research this afternoon.  Just curious.
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Offline bomber

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #13 on: December 06, 2013, 04:25:11 PM »
Anybody done any research into his past with the ANC?  It seems a little disturbing.  I've see a couple posts about him in places and have been doing a little research this afternoon.  Just curious.

The ANC has a checkered past, of this there is no doubt.

You should do the research so you can make up your own mind.

I would suggest that, while you do it, also research what living in SA as black at the time was really like (it's not as innocuous as Jim Crow) and judge what you learn of the ANC in that context.

My take, Mandella was no saint . . . . but the lack of genocide after apartheid is likely almost entirely his responsibility.

We had two bags of grass, 75 pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a saltshaker half-full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers... Also, a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether, and two dozen amyls. Not that we needed all that for the trip, but once you get locked into a serious drug collection, the tendency is to push it as far as you can.

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #14 on: December 06, 2013, 05:09:53 PM »
Mandela gave up violence. He became a man of peace and forgiveness. A giant amongst us all.

Mind you, the STN thread is full of bickering shit.
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Offline giaka

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #15 on: December 06, 2013, 05:15:19 PM »
Anybody done any research into his past with the ANC?  It seems a little disturbing.  I've see a couple posts about him in places and have been doing a little research this afternoon.  Just curious.

Seems to me he did what had to be done at the time in the name of justice and equality for the people of South Africa. I try to look at conflict from both sides from time to time.

Its that walk a mile in someones shoes before you criticize, thing. That why when you do criticize them you are a mile away and you have their shoes.
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Offline bomber

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #16 on: December 06, 2013, 05:47:59 PM »
Oddly, those who are happiest to criticize Mandela also speak eloquently about their willingness to fight their own government ...
We had two bags of grass, 75 pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a saltshaker half-full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers... Also, a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether, and two dozen amyls. Not that we needed all that for the trip, but once you get locked into a serious drug collection, the tendency is to push it as far as you can.

Offline bomber

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #17 on: December 06, 2013, 05:50:55 PM »

Mandela gave up violence. He became a man of peace and forgiveness. A giant amongst us all.

Mind you, the STN thread is full of bickering shit.

Isn't that pretty much what STN is?
We had two bags of grass, 75 pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a saltshaker half-full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers... Also, a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether, and two dozen amyls. Not that we needed all that for the trip, but once you get locked into a serious drug collection, the tendency is to push it as far as you can.

Offline giaka

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #18 on: December 06, 2013, 05:53:26 PM »
Oddly, those who are happiest to criticize Mandela also speak eloquently about their willingness to fight their own government ...

Interesting and full of truth from my recent observations.  ;)
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Online Skee

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #19 on: December 06, 2013, 06:29:20 PM »
Anybody done any research into his past with the ANC?  It seems a little disturbing.  I've see a couple posts about him in places and have been doing a little research this afternoon.  Just curious.

The ANC has a checkered past, of this there is no doubt.

You should do the research so you can make up your own mind.

I would suggest that, while you do it, also research what living in SA as black at the time was really like (it's not as innocuous as Jim Crow) and judge what you learn of the ANC in that context.

My take, Mandella was no saint . . . . but the lack of genocide after apartheid is likely almost entirely his responsibility.

Say (or think) what you want, there was far less racial animosity in South Africa 10 years after the end of arpathaid than ther was in America 110 years after the end of slavery.   It was somewhat unbelievable, everyone I spoke to in South Africa was full of hope and forgiveness.  This was his gift to the nation that imprisoned him.  At least that' the way I see it. 

He was a giant among us.
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Offline CLAY

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #20 on: December 06, 2013, 08:39:37 PM »
These are the things I wondered.  Thank you.  I haven't been a student of SA politics other than what the MS media fed me years ago before I was wise enough to check it for myself.  I was shocked at some of the black-on-black violence I found- but as some of you have mentioned- it's hard to know how it was when one of your own turns on you. 

Interesting stuff.  If nothing else it's once again clear that nothing is black-and-white.  No pun intended.  Of course it's easy to arm-chair quarterback the past sitting comfortably in the present.   :thumbsup:
"Most accidents happen when the meek meet the douchebags."  -Viffergyrl
"The wider the road, the worse the food." -Coho
Let's do some science.

Online Skee

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #21 on: December 10, 2013, 12:48:10 PM »
Interesting piece on the aftermath that I just stumbled upon.

Opinion: South Africa Has Failed to Live Up to Nelson Mandela's Legacy
"The mistake you cannot make is to judge the past through the eyes of the present.  Judge the past on its own terms."  
João Zilhão on the Assimilation Model of Human Origin

"The fishermen know that the sea is dangerous and the storm terrible, but they have never found these dangers sufficient reason for remaining ashore."   Vincent van Gogh

Offline hambonee

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #22 on: December 10, 2013, 02:03:41 PM »
Anybody done any research into his past with the ANC?  It seems a little disturbing.  I've see a couple posts about him in places and have been doing a little research this afternoon.  Just curious.

My take, Mandella was no saint . . . . but the lack of genocide after apartheid is likely almost entirely his responsibility.

Mandela and de Klerk pulled off something I don't think anyone else could have which was the transition lacking the predicted bloodshed...amazing lesson in forgiving...greater than I think I could be..

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #23 on: December 10, 2013, 03:31:51 PM »
These are the things I wondered.  Thank you.  I haven't been a student of SA politics other than what the MS media fed me years ago before I was wise enough to check it for myself.  I was shocked at some of the black-on-black violence I found- but as some of you have mentioned- it's hard to know how it was when one of your own turns on you. 

Interesting stuff.  If nothing else it's once again clear that nothing is black-and-white.  No pun intended.  Of course it's easy to arm-chair quarterback the past sitting comfortably in the present.   :thumbsup:

The ANC started off as a non violent bunch of rebels. The Apartheid regime arrested and tortured them in droves. Mandela was given the task of developing a military wing-the Spear of the Nation-to sabotage structures important to the state. It was a pretty amateur outfit and around 130 people were killed in error. He was then sent to prison, in 1964. The rest we all know.
Putting the laughter back into manslaughter

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #24 on: December 10, 2013, 09:18:57 PM »
These are the things I wondered.  Thank you.  I haven't been a student of SA politics other than what the MS media fed me years ago before I was wise enough to check it for myself.  I was shocked at some of the black-on-black violence I found- but as some of you have mentioned- it's hard to know how it was when one of your own turns on you. 

Interesting stuff.  If nothing else it's once again clear that nothing is black-and-white.  No pun intended.  Of course it's easy to arm-chair quarterback the past sitting comfortably in the present.   :thumbsup:

The ANC started off as a non violent bunch of rebels. The Apartheid regime arrested and tortured them in droves. Mandela was given the task of developing a military wing-the Spear of the Nation-to sabotage structures important to the state. It was a pretty amateur outfit and around 130 people were killed in error. He was then sent to prison, in 1964. The rest we all know.

 :wave:

Offline R Doug

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #25 on: December 10, 2013, 09:44:19 PM »
........
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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #26 on: December 11, 2013, 04:27:55 AM »
Putting the laughter back into manslaughter

Offline Formerly Known as Bigfoot

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #27 on: December 11, 2013, 04:39:38 AM »
Anybody done any research into his past with the ANC?  It seems a little disturbing.  I've see a couple posts about him in places and have been doing a little research this afternoon.  Just curious.

Yes.  His history, in my opinion, makes him less than the stellar person many are claiming.  Yes, he left prison and did some good things.  But one's history is always there for the world to see.
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Offline Formerly Known as Bigfoot

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #28 on: December 11, 2013, 04:42:50 AM »
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necklacing

I realize the article mentions Winnie, wife of Nelson, but how could he not have been involved?  I won't take away the good the man did later in life but still.
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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #29 on: December 11, 2013, 04:57:56 AM »
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necklacing

I realize the article mentions Winnie, wife of Nelson, but how could he not have been involved?  I won't take away the good the man did later in life but still.


He was in prison for part of it, then divorced her when her crimes came to light
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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #30 on: December 11, 2013, 07:53:27 AM »
Anybody done any research into his past with the ANC?  It seems a little disturbing.  I've see a couple posts about him in places and have been doing a little research this afternoon.  Just curious.

Yes.  His history, in my opinion, makes him less than the stellar person many are claiming.  Yes, he left prison and did some good things.  But one's history is always there for the world to see.

I think this is the case with most great people. I the end was the sum of his life positive or negative and by how far?
the above are merely the ramblings of a hamfisted fuckwit who has broken too many helmets.

Offline hambonee

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #31 on: December 11, 2013, 08:50:16 AM »
Anybody done any research into his past with the ANC?  It seems a little disturbing.  I've see a couple posts about him in places and have been doing a little research this afternoon.  Just curious.

Yes.  His history, in my opinion, makes him less than the stellar person many are claiming.  Yes, he left prison and did some good things.  But one's history is always there for the world to see.

Who claims he was stellar? He was a human being with faults like everyone. Martin Luther King, Ghandi, Our founding fathers...none were perfect, yet we still honor their accomplishments. The regime he ended, however, in a relatively non violent way was evil for sure...

Offline PatM

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #32 on: December 11, 2013, 08:56:54 AM »
Anybody done any research into his past with the ANC?  It seems a little disturbing.  I've see a couple posts about him in places and have been doing a little research this afternoon.  Just curious.

Yes.  His history, in my opinion, makes him less than the stellar person many are claiming.  Yes, he left prison and did some good things.  But one's history is always there for the world to see.
He used his moral authority to steer the country away from retribution against the white minority. I would have been a bloodshed if he had not done so.
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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #33 on: December 11, 2013, 09:16:26 AM »
You can pretty much never determine what would happen if X didn't do Y when dealing with people.

Offline Meemuh

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #34 on: December 11, 2013, 09:37:12 PM »
I guess a lot of people went to the funeral.

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Re: R.I.P. Madiba
« Reply #35 on: December 12, 2013, 07:27:00 AM »
Michelle was not pleased when Barry yelled out "Where all the white women at!?"

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