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Offline marc11

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When good bearings go bad...
« on: November 29, 2013, 08:49:57 PM »
The handlebars on my xr felt notchy. Look what I found....bottom bearing was fully seized and a pita to get out. Came out in prices.

Races obviously shot too. Everything out just waiting on new bearings and races.

I plan to use a threaded rod and washers to press the races in, can I press the races in with the bearing in the race and a washer on the bearing to ensure a full seat?

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Offline Scottzilla

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #1 on: November 29, 2013, 09:33:32 PM »
I hate steering head bearings, primarily because I never had the balls to swap out a set myself.  :)

Online Jim

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #2 on: November 29, 2013, 09:50:03 PM »
Quote
I plan to use a threaded rod and washers to press the races in, can I press the races in with the bearing in the race and a washer on the bearing to ensure a full seat?

I've never pressed bearings in where pressure was on the rolling bearing. Taper roller bearings, no pressing on the inner race with pressure going onto the rollers to press in the outer race. I have my doubts if a threaded rod method will have enough power to pull the outer race into the head.

One method you could do is to use one (or both) OLD outer races as "presses". You would need to grind or sand the OD of the OLD races down such that they readily slip/fall out of the head but are not so small that they do not give good contact to the new outer race face. So...

...New outer race placed into the head. Set old race against face of new race. Tap old race surface to set the new race into place (or use your threaded rod method - all depending upon the resistance of the new race in the head). Remove threaded rod, old race falls free - new outer race set into place.

Me, I just used a punch (driven by hammer) and went around the face of the new race to set them. When they are 'IN' the punch will have a different feel/rebound letting you know you're done.
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Offline Veefer800canuck

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #3 on: November 29, 2013, 10:06:12 PM »
Use the old races, no need to sand the O.D. Just cut a slot all the way through the old races, flip them upside down, and use them to tap the new races home.

See how I did mine, I used a 4-1/2" angle grinder with a thin ZipCut disc to cut the slot through the race.

This way, it doesn't stick in the steering head and is easy to pull out. Don't forget to de-burr it where you cut the slot.

Same-same for the lower bearing.

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Offline Veefer800canuck

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #4 on: November 29, 2013, 10:09:14 PM »
A bearing and seal driver set is also nice to have, although not strictly necessary if caution is used.

For smaller bearings and seals, an appropriate sized socket can be substituted.

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Offline marc11

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #5 on: November 29, 2013, 10:18:18 PM »
I was thinking of using a socket. Not sure I have one that is the right size to rest on the outside of the race and not be too fat to set the race.

I don't look when I knocked to old races out but do the sit flush with the head or slight below it?

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Online Jim

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #6 on: November 29, 2013, 10:28:28 PM »
They likely "bottom out" against a surface - otherwise, the outer races, lower specifically, could change position as the bike goes down the road (bumps / potholes / etc) which would result in the bearing adjustment "loosening up". Bad.
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Offline marc11

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2013, 10:31:14 PM »
They do there is a lip for them to rest on. I was just wondering if I use a socket to drive them does the socket need to fit the outer lip of the race and fit inside the head to recess the race.

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Online Jim

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #8 on: November 29, 2013, 11:26:50 PM »
Yes. You will be only working with the outer race - bearings and inner race will be sitting on the workbench. The socket needs to be of sufficient OD to contact the "little" face of the outer race while not overly contacting (getting stuck) in the head. This is where you could use an old outer race and modify it such that it, too, does not get wedged in the head while driving the new outer race.

I hope that's clear / answered your Q.
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Offline Justin

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #9 on: November 30, 2013, 01:02:36 AM »

For smaller bearings and seals, an appropriate sized socket can be substituted.


This also works on larger bearings if you have a larger socket set.  But, you can get bearing press set at harbor freight for less than large socket set these days. More than enough for the average garage toolbox.
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Offline marc11

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #10 on: November 30, 2013, 05:54:17 AM »

For smaller bearings and seals, an appropriate sized socket can be substituted.


This also works on larger bearings if you have a larger socket set.  But, you can get bearing press set at harbor freight for less than large socket set these days. More than enough for the average garage toolbox.

Yep. I checked HF and they had a set for $30. There is an HF store near my gym so I will stop by and pick one up.

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Offline marc11

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #11 on: November 30, 2013, 07:31:19 AM »
Turns out a 34mm socket fits perfectly which I happen to own. So no need to buy a tool.

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Offline Veefer800canuck

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #12 on: November 30, 2013, 10:02:11 AM »
Nobody saw the pic of the race with the slot cut into it?

I thought it was

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Online Jim

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #13 on: November 30, 2013, 10:25:56 AM »
Nobody saw the pic of the race with the slot cut into it?

Most certainly, yes. It does look like a nice, clean cut - that it does.

I do question - how much tension does the race have? How much does it resist being pulled out?

A socket, should a good size be found, gives a nice "hammer surface".

0.02 - If there are any Re-Tool / used buy-sell tool "pawn" shops around, they have bins of sockets where each socket is only a buck or two.
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Offline Mr. Whippy

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #14 on: November 30, 2013, 10:56:26 AM »
I haven't tried it with head bearings, but I keep the new replacement wheel bearings in the freezer and then heat the hub with a heat gun before inserting.  Nothing crazy but hot to touch.  It allows bearing races to go in much more easily.

Offline Veefer800canuck

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #15 on: November 30, 2013, 11:12:59 AM »
Nobody saw the pic of the race with the slot cut into it?

Most certainly, yes. It does look like a nice, clean cut - that it does.

I do question - how much tension does the race have? How much does it resist being pulled out?

A socket, should a good size be found, gives a nice "hammer surface".

0.02 - If there are any Re-Tool / used buy-sell tool "pawn" shops around, they have bins of sockets where each socket is only a buck or two.

Almost zero resistance to being pulled out of the frame after setting the new race right to the bottom. That's the beauty of it. The cut allows it to be withdrawn very easily.
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Online Jim

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #16 on: November 30, 2013, 02:44:36 PM »
Almost zero resistance to being pulled out of the frame after setting the new race right to the bottom. That's the beauty of it. The cut allows it to be withdrawn very easily.

Thx.

With tips being tossed about, here's another: For an inner bearing race on a shaft (think automobile rear axle shaft, the last I used this on), an easy removal with the axle shaft out of the car, bring the axle to a bench grinder. Grind through the outer race. The outer race and bearings fall free. Then start grinding through the inner race - at one spot. Before the grinder will touch the axle shaft (we don't want to mar the axle shaft) the race will be thin enough (and hot enough) that it will "pop" open and slip right off.
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Online Andrew

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #17 on: December 01, 2013, 11:30:16 AM »
Almost zero resistance to being pulled out of the frame after setting the new race right to the bottom. That's the beauty of it. The cut allows it to be withdrawn very easily.

Thx.

With tips being tossed about, here's another: For an inner bearing race on a shaft (think automobile rear axle shaft, the last I used this on), an easy removal with the axle shaft out of the car, bring the axle to a bench grinder. Grind through the outer race. The outer race and bearings fall free. Then start grinding through the inner race - at one spot. Before the grinder will touch the axle shaft (we don't want to mar the axle shaft) the race will be thin enough (and hot enough) that it will "pop" open and slip right off.

Yes that works quite well,
If you have access & a cutoff wheel try cutting a deep groove diagonally in the race but not all the way through. Then use a V chisel and a hammer in the center of the groove to crack the race cleanly through. the race will almost fall off and there is less chance of marring the axel/steering column. 
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Offline marc11

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #18 on: December 07, 2013, 07:44:43 AM »
Races went in with no drama. In the freezer over night and then a few taps with the 34mm socket and they seated. Warning up the bottom bearing now and then will pull the stem from the freezer and slide it on. 

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Offline marc11

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #19 on: December 07, 2013, 07:56:36 AM »
Bottom bearing and seal on. Zero issue. A few taps on the PVC pipe and it seated cleanly and smoothly. Wow it was easy. Just need to pack the bearing with grease and start the reassembly.  Easy job if you have a bearing race removal tool and even easier if I had a tool to take the bottom bearing off.

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Offline westkyguy

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #20 on: December 07, 2013, 03:44:26 PM »
Nobody saw the pic of the race with the slot cut into it?

I thought it was

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Great idea

Offline CLAY

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #21 on: December 17, 2013, 10:12:57 PM »
I have used the heat/freezer method for years.  It's funny when people come over, grab a mug from the freezer and ask "Why are there bearings in here?"   :lol:
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Offline marc11

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Re: When good bearings go bad...
« Reply #22 on: December 18, 2013, 03:34:37 AM »
I have used the heat/freezer method for years.  It's funny when people come over, grab a mug from the freezer and ask "Why are there bearings in here?"   :lol:

My wife wasn't found of finding the stem in there wherln she went to make dinner one night. It was a what the %-$ -$$-: is this thing doing in here.

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